AILSA CHANG, HOST:
European leaders reacted furiously today over the U.S. slapping visa bans on five prominent Europeans, including the former EU interior market commissioner. The U.S. has accused the EU of censoring free speech on the web by unfairly targeting U.S. tech giants with what they say is overly burdensome regulation. The latest move deepens a long-running dispute between the U.S. and EU over a major question - how do you regulate the internet? NPR's Eleanor Beardsley has been following this closely and joins us now from Paris. Hi, Eleanor.
ELEANOR BEARDSLEY, BYLINE: Hi, Ailsa.
CHANG: OK, so tell us, what is this about? Like, who has been banned? And what does this even mean to be banned?
BEARDSLEY: Yeah. Well, this is basically about the U.S. retaliating for what it sees are too many restrictions on the internet in Europe - in particular, the Digital Services Act, which is an EU regulation establishing a comprehensive legal framework for digital accountability, like to help fight disinformation and fake news. And as we've seen, things are going in the other direction in the U.S. An example, Elon Musk loosening regulations and cutting back on fact-checking on X. So some prominent individuals, notably Thierry Breton, who is a French businessman, politician and the former EU interior markets commissioner, they're henceforth banned from entering the U.S. And as one commentator on French TV put it, Breton is now being treated the same way as an ISIS terrorist or a narco-trafficker would be.
CHANG: Tell us more about what the reaction has been like all over Europe to this.
BEARDSLEY: Well, it's Christmas Eve, but still, there's been reaction. Europeans are furious. President Emmanuel Macron wrote on X that the measures amount to intimidation and coercion aimed at undermining European digital sovereignty. He said the European Union's digital regulations are democratically adopted and apply and ensure fair competition among platforms without targeting a third country. And Breton himself on X asked if a wave of McCarthyism is blowing again in the U.S. And he reminded readers that 90% of the European Parliament and all 27 members of the EU unanimously voted for these digital regulations. And Breton added, quote, "to our American friends, censorship isn't where you think it is." And actually, Ailsa, here's Breton speaking just a few days ago on French television.
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THIERRY BRETON: (Speaking French).
BEARDSLEY: So he says, "we don't need any lessons about manipulation and fake news on social networks." He said freedom of speech is total and guaranteed in Europe.
CHANG: Total and guaranteed. Well, I mean, there are differences in the way speech is regulated in Europe versus the U.S., right?
BEARDSLEY: Yeah, there are, because of history. Europe has laws against what's known as hate speech because of its Nazi past. In Germany, they are especially strict. In France, too. You are not allowed to spread neo-Nazi propaganda, so it's a little different than the U.S., where hate speech is not a legal term. This is not the first time this dispute over free speech has come up. When Vice President Vance spoke at the Munich Security Conference earlier this year, he shocked Europeans by saying he was worried that free speech was under threat in Europe, while he said nothing about free speech in Russia.
CHANG: Well, how do you think Europe is going to respond to this move by the Trump administration?
BEARDSLEY: Well, Ailsa, tensions are high between the U.S. and the EU already with President Trump's tariffs, but especially with the U.S.'s latest national security strategy, which really takes aim at Europe, treating the continent no longer as a longtime ally but almost as an adversary, even meddling in European democracy, saying that, you know, Europe was heading towards civilizational erasure with immigration and encouraging populist and right-wing parties. One European parliamentarian lashed out today and said, quote, "we are not a colony of the United States." And listen to this political commentator, Renaud Pilat, on an LCI news channel today, what he thinks Europe should do.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)
RENAUD PILAT: (Speaking French).
BEARDSLEY: He says, "Thierry Breton can't go on American territory anymore. We need to ban Elon Musk from coming to Europe."
CHANG: That is NPR's Eleanor Beardsley. Thank you so much, Eleanor, (speaking French).
BEARDSLEY: (Speaking French). Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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